• CLUBS ARE AIMED AT:   MID TO HIGH HANDICAPPERS (and beginners)
• IRON TYPE:   CAVITY BACK
• FORGED OR CAST:   CAST

• LENGTH:   Very close to 1/4 INCH SHORTER THAN STANDARD (see extra notes- 3 clubs measured- see photo with table)
• LIE:   Close to STANDARD (see photo of table)

• GRIP SIZE:   STANDARD
• GRIPS:   LAMKIN CROSSLINE 360

• I THINK THE CLUBS WOULD BE SUITED TO:   Golfers of all abilities who measure between 5 foot 8 and 6 foot or so in height and prefer the feel of light weight shafts in their irons and have a slow swing speed and tempo.

One.  Selling or trading in your clubs to a second hand golf club business is a bad idea because second hand golf club businesses will very likely make you a low or very low offer for your clubs. The reason for this is partly because it’s very hard for anyone to accurately predict how much second hand golf clubs are worth ie what price they will sell for and how long it will take at any given price. A business has to be confident that they will sell the clubs for significantly more money than what they are offering you and since they’re not even sure what price they will sell them for or how long it will take, that will likely lead them to making you a low or very low offer for your clubs.

Two.  I would highly recommend that you sell your clubs on eBay using a 7 day auction to a buyer who lives in the same country as you (or within the UK if you live in the UK). This will most likely get you the highest price possible for your clubs compared to the other options, especially since selling on eBay is now free for private sellers (non business sellers). Selling your clubs by auction is the best option if you want to sell them within a month for the highest possible price but only if your photos are good ie very close up shots of all of the clubfaces and backs of clubheads taken in good lighting, as well as other photos showing the soles, shafts (including shaft labels) and grips. If you also get a photo of all of the clubs over the edge of a table (as shown in my photos) that will let the buyer know of any irregular shaft lengths without you actually having to measure all of the club lengths with a metal ruler or tape measure. Bad or lazy photo taking will put many people off bidding on your auction and will likely lead to a low winning bid because people will be unsure what condition your clubs are in or if there is something bad about the clubs which you haven’t taken a photo of. I think that good photos can increase the winning bid by more than £100 compared to bad photos so spending a little longer taking photos is definitely worth your time.

Three.  The alternative to selling your clubs on eBay is to sell them to a golfer who lives close to you by advertising them on obvious websites but there will be lots more people on eBay who will be interested in buying your clubs compared to local golfers. The more people there are who are interested in buying your clubs the more likely it is that they will sell for the highest price possible. Posting a set of irons within the UK will only cost you around £13.50 and you will save money and hassle if you pick a good courier (see paragraph 13).

Four.  Selling your clubs using a ‘buy it now’ listing on eBay comes with more risk and potentially more hassle than an auction because you could mistakenly list your clubs at a price that’s much lower than what the clubs would sell at in auction but a ‘buy it now’ listing will most likely get you a higher price than an eBay auction but only if you are prepared to wait several months to get it. If you choose to use a ‘buy it now’ listing and you price it too high, your clubs will never sell. Price it too low and they will likely sell quickly and somewhere in the middle could take several months. A ‘buy it now’ listing also comes with more risk because the higher the price you sell your clubs for, the more likely it is that you will have an unhappy buyer who thinks they paid too much if your photos have made your clubs look in better condition than they actually are in. If that’s the case they may want to return them to you for a refund under the eBay money back guarantee (see paragraph 9).

Five.  You can’t change or add more photos to your eBay listing once your eBay auction goes live, so it’s best to make sure that the photos are good and that all of your photos are added before you start it. eBay allow 24 photos for free so the more photos the better.

Six.  Auctions on eBay with a reserve price rarely sell because it puts many people off bidding so the winning bid is almost always lower than the reserve price so it may be better to start the auction at whatever the reserve price is instead but auctions with a low start price get placed higher up the results page and will get seen by the most people.

Seven.  Some second hand golf club businesses offer a ‘price match guarantee’ or ‘we’ll beat quotes from other businesses by 10%’ etc but that involves you wasting time contacting multiple businesses to get the highest quote possible and then wasting more time entering into conversation trying to prove that another business offered you X amount for your clubs. By selling your clubs by eBay auction, you cut all of the unnecessary conversation out because you only have to take good photos once, add them to your listing, write a short listing description, list the auction and then let it run and the clubs will be sold to the highest bidder. Many second hand golf club businesses will actually look at eBay auctions as well as lots of golfers wanting to buy clubs for their own use.

Eight.  eBay don’t allow sellers to do trade ins/ part exchanges. If you trade in clubs to any seller on eBay you will not get any help from eBay if the seller doesn’t honour the agreed trade in price after they get your clubs. You have to buy and sell clubs on separate eBay listings.

Nine.  Bad or minimal photos can either make second hand golf clubs look in much better condition than they actually are in or they can leave out important information such as irregular shafts or irregular shaft lengths. If that’s the case, your buyer can return them to you for a refund under the eBay moneyback guarantee or they can ask you for money off instead. I think this also depends on the price your clubs sell for. For example, I have bought clubs from a seller on eBay via auction and I thought that the sellers’ photos had made the clubs look in significantly better condition than they actually were in but I did not ask for money off or want to return them because I was still happy with the price I paid but had the winning bid been much higher I would have either asked for money off or returned the clubs back for a refund under the eBay money back guarantee. 

As a seller, you don’t have to give a buyer any money off if you don’t want to but if you and the buyer do not agree on a partial refund amount, the buyer will have the option to return clubs for a full refund and eBay will charge you for the buyer’s return postage costs via the free eBay returns postage label. This is true even if you don’t accept returns. A buyer can also return clubs to you if your buyer cares about club specs and you have mentioned something wrong on your listing such as ‘standard length and lie’ but they aren’t. 

These are similar problems to what you’ll have if you sell or trade in your clubs to an online golf club business because they will likely reduce the offer after they get your clubs. This is also true if they disagree with how you rated them compared to their condition ratings but it’s also possible that their initial offer for your clubs will be so low that they won’t reduce it unless the photos you send them are either really bad or if your ratings are very different to what theirs would be.

Ten.  It’s best to only mention anything that you are sure about on your listing such as standard length or lie angles so unless you really trust the previous owner to have given you accurate information on clubs specs either don’t mention it on your listing or you could maybe write that the previous owner told you that information but you haven’t measured them yourself so you’re not sure. Loft and lie angles on irons and wedges can shift a bit with use so the clubs you are selling could be in a different spec to what they were when you bought them. 

Eleven. The eBay moneyback guarantee is open to abuse from buyers by people making false claims about the listing being ‘not as described’ but anyone abusing it will likely get banned from using eBay. Since I started taking very close up photos of all the clubfaces a number of years ago I haven’t had anyone who has wanted to return clubs to me under the eBay moneyback guarantee. Close to 6% of buyers have returned clubs to me but only because the clubs didn’t suit but I offer a 14 day trial on second hand iron sets.

Twelve.  Sometimes the winning bidder will change their mind and decide not to pay. Buyers aren’t allowed to do that but people still do it. If that happens you can either offer the second or third highest bidder to pay instead via a ‘second chance offer’ or you can re-list the auction again but if you wait two weeks or so you may get another discounted selling fee offer from eBay. 

Thirteen.  Occasionally couriers lose parcels but you can pay extra to insure the parcel to the full value which means that the courier will pay you out the value of the parcel if they fail to deliver it. I currently use Parcelforce for iron sets which is the courier that Royal Mail uses for larger sized parcels. They have not lost a single parcel of mine in at least 700 parcels posted. I have never had a buyer claim that they didn’t receive the clubs either (apart from on two occasions when the clubs were delivered to a local Post Office and they failed to leave a note in the letterbox telling the buyer where the clubs were but both buyers got the clubs after I told them about it.) 

The least hassle method for using Parcelforce is to pay for postage at the Post Office which as of 04/09/24 costs £13.45 for a set of irons delivered anywhere in the UK, including Northern Ireland. This includes £150 cover with the option to pay extra for more. You don’t even need to waste time weighing or measuring box dimensions because they will do that for you. Parcelforce allow box sizes of up to 150cm and nearly all golf club boxes are 100-123 cm in length. Sometimes Post Office workers will forget to give you the correct receipt with the tracking number on it which is your proof of postage. The tracking number will be labelled as ‘barcode’ on the receipt.

I advise not using eBay’s postage labels to post items out because in the past I was overcharged for them and you also don’t have the option to pay extra to insure the clubs to the full value.

Fourteen.  When packaging iron sets, it is best to use a golf club box or similar sized box. Golf club pro shops will normally give away spare golf club boxes for free if you don’t have one. The big second hand golf club businesses use elastic bands to secure clubs together so that they aren’t rattling around inside the box and they may wrap bubble wrap or paper around the clubheads as well. You need the right sized elastic bands for that though (number 64 size or close to that) which most people don’t have so a good alternative is to either wrap each clubhead with bubble wrap or kitchen roll and tape it around each clubhead or to use headcovers instead. It’s best to not use any tape directly on the clubs though because it will likely leave a sticky residue when its removed. You can then just put the clubs inside the box one at a time and it won’t matter if the clubs are rattling around inside it because the clubheads will be well protected. 

If you don’t use a golf club box to post the clubs or you over-protect them by wrapping the grips and shafts tightly with bubble wrap etc then it could make it hard to remove and your buyer may damage clubs in the process by cutting into the grips or shafts.

Fifteen.  If you have a business eBay account, you may get significantly reduced eBay fees for every listing instead of receiving regular offers but you have to pay insertion fees just to advertise on eBay but overall it can work out to 50-80% off eBay fees. 

I think eBay may only give significantly reduced eBay fees to business accounts that have a very low percentage of buyers returning items under the eBay money back guarantee.

1. DIY Length and Lie Angle Custom Fitting For Irons And Wedges And Why They Can Be Important.

Key Points:

1. The clubhead needs to be square to the ground at impact in order to strike the ball solid and out of the middle of the clubface, particularly when not using a golf tee.

2. The lie angle of a golf club is the angle between the clubhead and the shaft.

3. You will need a particular lie angle spec in your irons depending on your own stance and swing in order to have the clubheads square to the ground at impact.

4. You can use Ping’s colour code chart to find out what that is, even if buying irons from a different brand.

5. If the lie angles of your irons aren’t right for you, you will likely be able to adjust your stance to suit the lie angles of your clubs instead.

6. Lie angles can be adjusted on irons (and wedges) by a club pro or golf shop using a loft/lie machine but many club pros are very cautious and will only adjust by a small amount, most likely out of fear of breaking clubs and being held responsible.

The lie angle of a golf club is the angle created between the shaft and the sole of the clubhead when the club is in the address position. 

Getting the correct lie angles in your irons and wedges for your own individual stance and swing is important because the soles of the clubheads need to be square to the ground at impact to allow you to strike the ball solid and to hit the ball out of the middle of the clubface and at the target. Lie angles are more important the more loft the club has.

In general, golfers that are shorter in height need irons and wedges with flatter lie angles and/or shorter length clubs and taller golfers need more upright lie angles and/or longer length clubs. It also depends on what stance you have. If you like to stand tall in the address position (and at impact) you will need more upright lie angles and/or longer length clubs. If you like to stand very bent over at the hips with lots of knee bend you will need flatter lie angles and/or shorter length clubs. The last or second last photo on this listing shows two extreme examples of a very bent over stance versus a very tall stance, just to show what this looks like. 

If you buy a set of irons (or wedges) and the lie angles are either too upright or too flat for you, in many cases you will be able to adjust your stance to suit the lie angles of your clubs, which is not ideal if you have a preferred stance but it can be done. This should either raise or lower your hands at impact and thus change the angle of the shaft. You can also vary the distance you stand from the ball. The further you stand away from the ball, the higher your hands will be but changing your stance will make a larger difference to the height of your hands than varying the distance you stand from the ball. 

You will likely not have to adjust your stance by as much as either of the golfers shown in the photo. The photo of the golfer with a very tall stance is a younger Bryson Dechambeau when he used to use irons which were ten degrees upright in lie angle, which is extremely upright and more upright than any other golfer would use. He also stood further away from the ball than normal as well which also raised his hands to a higher position. This I understand was to accommodate the ‘one plane’ swing that he was using at the time, in which the clubhead travels on the shaft plane at address throughout the whole swing, which is almost impossible unless you have clubs with very upright lie angles.

Lie angles can be adjusted on any iron or wedge by using a ‘loft/lie machine’ which most club pros and big golf shops have and they usually charge around £3-5 per club to do this for you. However, If you are happy and able to adjust your stance to suit the lie angles of your irons and wedges, you will not need to pay someone to have them adjusted but if the lie angles of your clubs are very irregular (such as the PW being two degrees upright and the 9 iron being one degree flat etc) I would advise having them adjusted so that you don’t have to take a significantly different stance with each club in your bag. One or two degrees doesn’t sound like much but I have read that a one degree change in the shaft angle corresponds to a ten degree change in the angle of the sole of the club ie toe up or toe down, which is significant. 

Many club pros are very cautious and will not make loft or lie angle adjustments on cast irons (ie non-forged irons) out of fear of breaking clubs and being held responsible for it. (A clubmaker on YouTube actually adjusted the lie angle of a cast iron by seven degrees before the club broke). Forged irons are easier to bend but many club pros will only bend by a maximum of two degrees in either direction.

The following is how Ping custom fit people for irons and wedges. This is based on what I have read online from Ping, I think they provide the most helpful information in regards to custom fitting for irons in regards to club lengths and lie angles. This information can be used for any brand of clubheads but it’s worth mentioning that standard spec lie angles vary a little from brand to brand but it will be at most 1.5 degrees of difference. For example, Mizuno’s standard spec lie angle of a 7 iron is 61.5 degrees and Ping’s is 63 degrees. The rest will be somewhere in between.

According to Ping their lie angle estimates get golfers to within plus or minus one degree of their required lie angle spec 75 % of the time and within plus or minus two degrees 95% of the time.

Start with static fitting:

Use Ping’s colour code chart to give you a good estimate of what lie angle spec you need in your irons and wedges, even if you are buying from another brand of clubheads. To watch a relevant youTube video on this from Ping, please do a youTube search for ‘2017 Ping chart’ and watch the first youTube result.

This estimate (based solely on your ‘wrist to floor’ measurement) will give you a good estimate if you buy a set of irons which are standard length. This is regardless of what height you are. If you buy a set of irons which are longer or shorter than standard length, you can adjust the lie angle spec slightly to compensate, but it will only be around half a degree for every half inch longer or shorter in club length.

Ping give club length recommendations based on your height, but precise club lengths are just a recommendation and are not really that important, but lie angles are. Club lengths become more important if you are either really tall or are of average height but like to stand very tall in the address position. If either of those apply to you and you buy a set of irons or wedges that are too short in length for you, you will struggle to adjust your stance by the required amount and you will have to get the lie angles adjusted to be made much more upright, which your club pro probably won’t want to do if they’re very cautious. 

Some golfers who prioritise accuracy and consistency may prefer shorter length clubs because shorter clubs can help with that and some golfers who want to hit the ball longer may prefer longer length clubs because longer clubs help to increase swing speed.

What you need to do:

1. Wear normal shoes (without big heels) and have a friend measure the vertical distance between your wrist and the floor in inches using a tape measure when you are standing upright with your hands hanging down naturally by your sides. (Just to be clear, you want to measure from where you hand meets your wrist, ie the wrist crease).
2. Do a google image search for ‘Ping colour code chart’ and look at the first image result.
3. Match up your ‘wrist to floor’ measurement with a lie angle specification. This is the recommended lie angle spec required for you if you buy a set of irons which are standard length, regardless of what height you are.

1. Do a youTube search for ‘DIY lie angle check’ and watch the first youTube result by ‘50 yards longer’ which is a short, helpful video that shows you how to do the test. Just to add to the information provided in that video, you need to use either a good whiteboard marker or a good permanent marker pen, but using a permanent marker pen will require more effort to clean the lines off your clubfaces afterwards.
2. You can do this test when you are hitting off a range mat or when hitting from grass but if you are on grass you need to use a tee. You can do the test with all of your irons and wedges, or to save time you could do it with perhaps three or four clubs instead such as a long iron, mid iron, short iron and your most lofted wedge. If the lines are not going straight up and down the clubfaces leave the lines on the clubfaces and hand all of your clubs to your club pro to make the required lie angle adjustments, or make changes to your stance and re-do the test and keep repeating this until the lines are going straight up the clubfaces.
3. Clean the lines off the clubfaces afterwards using water and a sponge scourer or cloth and dry the clubheads using a towel. (You may need to clean lines off clubfaces every few shots or so if the new lines are going over the old ones and you can’t see what direction the new lines are going.)

Before buying any new golf clubs and before paying to get custom fit for golf clubs I recommend watching a helpful youTube video by Tiger Woods’ ex swing coach Hank Haney. (Hank coached Tiger from 2004- 2010.) The video covers some of the problems with modern golf clubs and club fitting. To find the video, please do a youTube search for ‘Golf equipment today on the Hank Haney Podcast’ and its the first video on the results page. If you start the video at the one minute and twenty four second mark you can skip his sponsored ads.

I would advise anyone who is unsure of what new or second hand iron set they should buy to get custom fit for irons, not because its really important to be ‘custom fit’ for golf clubs by a fitter, but because its the easiest and quickest way to try out many different clubhead and shaft options in the one place. Getting custom fit for irons is more important to do if your performance and scoring is important to you and you want to find out what the most suitable clubhead and shaft combinations are for your current golf game. In most cases, every time you buy and sell an iron set it will cost you a significant amount of money just to change clubs so it’s good if you can buy a suitable iron set on your first purchase. If you happen to live close to a big second hand golf club shop with many iron sets to choose from and they allow you to try the clubs out at a driving range or practice net, that’s a good alternative but you will not know what lie angle spec the irons (or wedges) are when you are trying them out and lie angles can be important as mentioned in my first guide. During an iron fitting you will be able to try out many different clubhead and shaft options in your required lie angle spec for your current stance and swing.  

What I have written below is based on a mixture of my own research on this topic, from watching different youTube videos, reading online and also my own opinions from my past experience of playing golf and trying different clubheads and shafts. Some of this information also came from Mark Crossfield in some of his older youTube videos. Mark Crossfield is a club pro and teacher and is quite big on youTube. I like some his older youTube videos because he challenged many golf myths.

There are different types of custom fitting available for irons but before paying to get custom fit I would advise checking that you will be able to try out a significant number of different shaft and clubhead options. Some golf shops will advertise custom fitting for irons when they are offering for you to try out three or four different clubhead options with just a few different shafts in three different flexes but that is not a proper custom fitting. At a proper fitting you will be able try out virtually every clubhead and shaft option available, should you want to. The biggest problem with custom fitting for irons is that it’s mainly only geared towards trying and buying the latest brand new iron clubheads from any given brand of clubheads but it will still be beneficial for you if you would like to buy a second hand set afterwards on eBay for a lot less money than what a new iron set will cost you. Buying a second hand iron set from a seller on eBay that accepts returns is also safer than buying a new iron set because worst case scenario is that you will have to pay around £13 to post the clubs back to the seller for a full refund if you don’t like them. If you buy a new iron set and you decide after a week or two that you don’t like them or the shafts aren’t right for you etc, you won’t be able to return them for a refund and you will likely have to sell them to someone else for much less than what you paid for them, which has happened sometimes with iron sets that I have bought. I have bought sets of irons from people in almost new condition who told me that they were custom fit for them and that they liked the clubheads and shafts at their fitting but decided a week or two after buying them that either the shafts or clubheads weren’t right for them and they sold them to me for much less than they paid for them. 

A couple of limitations though of custom fitting for irons is that you likely will have to hit balls off range mats or artificial turf when trying different clubheads and shaft out. This will give you a good idea of what you’ll like and perform best with but hitting balls off range mats is not the same as real grass. You can often strike the turf a little before the ball on a range mat and get away with it and still strike the ball well when you wouldn’t have from grass. This can give you a false perception of how consistent you are at your fitting with any clubheads or shafts that you are trying. You also might only be able to try different clubheads and shafts out with the 7 iron only which is not ideal either. 

Brands of clubheads release a new range of irons every two years or so with very minor tweaks made. In nearly all cases, the brands that make iron shafts are completely separate to the brands that make the clubheads and most or all of the current available shafts have been available for many years so you will very likely find a set of second hand irons on eBay that is almost identical to your most preferred clubhead and shaft combinations that you tried at your custom fitting session, particularly if you are open to buying irons from any brand of clubheads. I know that many golfers will have a favourite brand of clubheads but all of the well known brands have many players on tour playing their clubs (and playing well with them) so I think they all make equally or almost equally good clubs and they all sell very similar clubhead options from one brand to the next, so you are giving yourself more options to choose from in the second hand golf club market if you look at all of the top brands of clubheads. My thoughts on this is that if there’s a successful tour player using irons from a certain brand of clubheads, the brand is making clubs good enough for any amateur to use. Please note that most second hand iron sets available on eBay are standard length or close to it so if you want irons that are significantly longer or shorter than standard, you have far less second hand iron sets to choose from so you may struggle to find a second hand iron set on eBay that is nearly identical to your preferred options at your custom fitting session. New irons beat second hand irons on performance because of sharp grooves which my guide on ‘value for money in second hand golf clubs’ goes into more detail about so when I write ‘almost identical’ I mean excluding the worn groove issue on second hand irons and wedges, but that mainly applies to irons and wedges that are well used ie in bad condition.

Each brand of clubheads such as Titleist or TaylorMade offer around 4 to 6 different clubhead options for irons. There will be a set of non forgiving muscle back irons at one end to a set of very forgiving chunky looking cavity back irons at the other end and there will be 2-3 sets in between those two extremes with variable levels of forgiveness, clubface size and offset. Please note that the lofts of irons between different iron models can vary considerably. In general, the lofts of the most forgiving irons ie the ones aimed at higher handicappers have stronger lofts than the less forgiving irons aimed at lower handicappers. This is to give people the impression that they are hitting their irons further but its really a lie. Brands are just taking a 4-6 iron and writing 7 on it, although they often make the club the length of a 7 iron but the clubhead isn’t a 7 iron. For example, the 7 iron loft of Titleist’s least forgiving iron (the MB) is 35 degrees but the loft of Titleist’s most forgiving 7 iron (the T400) is 26 degrees and for comparion the Titleist MB 5 iron is 27 degrees so if you are trying to compare distances between different iron clubheads at your custom fitting session you can’t properly do so unless you know what the loft is, but with irons and wedges the two most important things are to be able to consistently hit the ball online and a specific distance, not how far you can hit them. Picking the clubheads you want in your irons should be down to a combination of how much forgiveness you want on off centre hits and what you like the look of in the address position. Some golfers prefer irons with a very compact look with minimal offset and thin toplines and others prefer the opposite or something in the middle. 

There are far more iron shafts available than there are clubheads and because there are so many there will be a number of these shafts that will be suitable for you, but a number of these shafts will also be unsuitable. 

In my opinion the most important things to learn from a custom fitting session for irons are what your preferred iron shafts are, rather than your preferred clubheads. This is because I think a suitable or unsuitable shaft will make a much bigger difference to your consistency of ball striking and accuracy compared to a suitable or unsuitable clubhead. Just to explain the reasons for this, I think the difference in forgiveness levels on off- centre hits between most iron clubheads that are targeted at amateur golfers, ie any clubhead with a cavity, is much smaller than what most people make out. I don’t think anyone is sure how much of a difference this actually is because without robot testing it’s very hard for anyone to know because even the best amateur golfers are not consistent enough to test this properly. If the clubhead brands are doing robot testing to test the differences in carry distances and accuracy on off centre hits between their different clubhead models, or between their latest and previous models they are not making the results of that public so because of that, take anything a reviewer or brand tells you on how forgiving a club is compared to another club with a pinch of salt. As long as there is at least a small cavity in the back of the clubhead the iron will be quite forgiving on off-centre hits and if you strike the ball solidly and out of the centre of the clubface the brand or model of clubhead will not make any significant or noticeable difference to your shots but a suitable or unsuitable shaft will. Some iron shaft models are supposed to be low launch, low spin and others high launch, high spin etc but according to Mark Crossfield in his youTube videos when he and other very good golfers tested that out with a launch monitor when trying different shafts the difference a shaft (and flex of the shaft) makes to to launch angle and spin rate from one shaft to the next is very small, but depending on how you swing the golf club some shafts will just work better with your swing and will help you to be more consistent with ball striking and accuracy, so you should pick a shaft that helps you strike the ball solidly and at the target as consistently as possible rather than picking a shaft for a desired ball flight. A suitable or unsuitable shaft for you will be down to a combination of your shaft weight preferences and the makeup of a shaft and how much it suits your swing. In general, lighter weight iron shafts allow you to swing the club faster and but often at a cost of consistency of ball striking and accuracy. Heavier iron shafts slow down your swing speed a bit and therefore you won’t hit the ball as far but you may be more consistent. How heavy is too heavy and how light is too light will vary from golfer to golfer so you need to try iron shafts of different weights to find that out. 

Mark Crossfield said in one of his videos that he thinks shaft weight is more important than flex. Shaft flex can be important as well but just not as much as shaft weight. Although heavier weight shafts can make you more consistent, golfers who have lower back pain or joint pain may prefer lighter weight shafts than they are easier on the body and may leave you less sore after your round.

Bryson Dechambeau said in one of his youTube videos words to the effect of it is easier to strike the ball well and be accurate when you are trying to swing fast (but in control). I think this is particularly true when you are nervous so based on that I think you need a shaft that works for your 80-90% swing. Bubba Watson said that when you are nervous and you start to be delicate is when bad things can happen.

Iron shaft weights can be broken up into different weight brackets which can be described as:

Heavy/ Tour Weight: 120+ grams (mostly steel)

Mid Weight: 100-120 grams (mostly steel)

Light Weight: 80-100 grams (mostly steel)

Super Light Weight: Under 80 grams (mostly graphite)

I have read that in general, most male amateur golfers prefer iron shafts in the mid weight range ie between 100 and 120 grams. Most professional golfers on tour prefer iron shafts in the heavy weight range ie 120+ grams and most tour players’ iron shafts would be at the heavier end of that ie between 125 and 132 grams.

The bulk majority of second hand iron sets on eBay (for men) have steel shafts and the lightest steel shaft currently available for irons is 73 grams in weight and most graphite iron shafts are under 80 grams in weight.

‘Swing weight’ is supposed to be a measure of how heavy or light a club feels when you swing a club, rather than the actual weight of the club. Different irons have different swing weights according to the standard specs of iron models that you find online. Irons aimed at good players have slightly higher swing weights than irons aimed a higher handicappers and if you are comparing iron clubheads from brand to brand that are similar in terms of who they are aimed at and how they look at the address position they will be very similar swing weights. You get iron shafts that are variable weights such as the True Temper AMT tour white shafts and according to True Temper they have adjusted the balance point on each shaft so the swing weight of each club is the same but every time I have swung irons with AMT shafts the lighter long iron shafts feel lighter to me to swing compared to the heavier short iron shafts even though they are supposed to be all the same swing weight so based on that I would advise to ignore swing weight and pick irons based on shaft weight if you want the clubs to feel heavier or lighter to you when you swing them.

Different iron shafts are targeted at golfers with different swing speeds and swing tempos. Shaft flex is normally chosen based on a mixture of swing tempo and swing speed. A good fitter will know the iron shafts that are targeted at different swing speeds and tempos and after watching you hit balls they will know which shafts they should suggest for you to try. A bad fitter won’t know what shafts they should be suggesting for you to try or a bad fitter could be suggesting and pointing you towards the most expensive shafts available because they may be on commission and think that you are going to buy a new set of irons with expensive shafts, in which case they would make more money from you the more money you spend. 

Swing speed= how fast the clubhead is travelling at impact. 

Swing tempo= how you swing the golf club fast or slow, such as speed of backswing, a pause or no pause at the top of backswing, starting the downswing before the backswing is finished and how wristy you are through impact. 

An example of a fast swing tempo is Rory McIlroy whose whole swing is fast, from start to finish and does not have a pause at the top of the backswing. Rory McIlroy also has a fast or very fast swing speed. Golfers with a fast swing speed and fast swing tempo put the more stress on the shaft during the swing and cause them to bend more so they usually prefer heavier iron shafts, extra stiff shafts and shafts that are targeted at them because they find them easier to control and find the centre of the clubface consistently with. Golfers who have a slow swing tempo and slow swing tempo usually prefer light or mid weight iron shafts and regular or senior flex shafts and shafts that are targeted at them because those shafts will help them hit the ball further and get the ball up in the air but part of the problem with higher handicappers is that many of them have  a very slow swing speed because their technique is bad, not because they aren’t capable of swinging the club faster, which means they can’t get the ball up in the air enough so a suitable shaft can help them with that but golf is hard and learning a good golf swing takes time and effort but once golfers improve their swings, either by teaching themselves or through lessons (which I plan to write a guide about) they will no longer have a slow swing speed problem and they can prioritise a shaft that helps them be more consistent, rather than hit it further or with a a higher launch angle.

What normally happens when getting custom fit for irons in regards to iron shafts is that the fitter will start you out with the ‘stock’ shaft that come with the iron clubheads that you are trying or want to try. The stock shaft is just a particular shaft that the clubhead brand has chosen to come with the irons if you were buying a standard spec iron set in a golf shop ‘off the rack’. For example, for the latest set of Titleist T200 irons in 2024 the stock shaft is the True Temper AMT black in either regular or stiff flex. It would be possible to buy the T200 irons with other shafts such as KBS Tour or virtually any other iron shaft available but it would need to be done as a custom fit option. 

If you don’t like the stock shafts or even if you do like them your fitter may suggest to try another shaft. I would suggest to ask what weight the shafts are that you were trying and if you found the clubs too heavy or too light for your liking you could ask to try a heavier or lighter shaft.Whenever you do find a shaft you like and are performing well with you could then ask to try different shafts in that same weight range in order to try and find other shafts that you like, which will give you more options to choose from when you are looking at second hand iron sets on eBay afterwards. I also recommend asking to try your most preferred shaft in the different flexes available to just double check that you know what the best flex option is for you in that shaft. 

I advise to make a note of or take a photo of shaft labels of the specific shafts (and the flex) that you like the most during your fitting/ performing best with and then I would advise to save yourself hundreds of pounds and buy a second hand iron set on eBay afterwards that have one of your preferred iron shafts by doing an eBay search for ‘golf irons’ plus that specific shaft. For example, ‘golf irons Dynamic gold 120 S300 stiff’. It would be safest to choose an iron set that have shafts that you already know you like or as an alternative you could choose irons that have shafts which are of very similar weight and the same flex, but this will be a higher risk option because you may not like how that shaft feels or performs for you even though it’s the same weight. You may need to use google to look up the weight of any iron shafts that you see in second hand irons advertised on eBay.

You could also take a photo of your most preferred clubheads at your custom fitting session to help you later when you are looking at second hand irons on eBay. It may be helpful to take a photo of the back of one of the clubheads just to make a note of the clubhead model but also a photo of the 7 iron clubhead behind the ball (like in my photos) because this will help you later when you are trying to find a set of similar second hand irons on eBay . Most sellers on eBay do not take photos of the clubheads behind the ball so you could do a google or youtube search of any specific iron model that you find on eBay to try and find a review that shows you what the clubheads look like in the address position. Pay attention to how big the clubheads are (relative to the size of the ball) and also how much offset there is and compare this to the photo you took at your custom fitting.

The most popular iron shaft on the PGA tour is True Temper Dynamic Gold which weighs between 127 and 132 grams depending on the flex. This is at the heavier end of iron shaft weight and is a heavier iron shaft than most amateur golfers like but I think it’s worth trying at your custom fitting session just to see if you find it too heavy or not and if it isn’t, it’s worth trying other iron shafts in the 120+ gram weight range. When you are trying iron shafts at your fitting, go with your first instincts on this when you first try a shaft. You will swing a club and think that it feels too heavy or too stiff etc and you won’t like it. It may be because the shaft is not targeted at you swing speed or tempo. Some golfers will be much more sensitive than others in how much of a difference they actually notice between different iron shafts and how much of a difference a ‘suitable’ or ‘unsuitable’ shaft actually makes to their shots. This is partly why I think its worth trying many different iron shafts at your fitting, to see whether different shafts make much of a difference to your shots. You may be told at your fitting that it’s best to not try many options but your fitting is your best opportunity to try many shafts conveniently in the one place and you don’t know until you try. This may save you time and money later if you buy irons on eBay and find that the shafts don’t suit you. I have watched youTube videos of Bryson Dechembeau using children's clubs and obviously nothing about those clubs suit him but he is so talented that he could play well with any irons with any shafts. With the kids clubs he has to adjust his stance and slow down his swing speed and swing tempo in order to hit good shots. Bryson normally has a very fast swing speed and tempo and most amateur golfers do not swing the club anywhere near as fast as he does but I don’t think that most amateur golfers are good at tweaking their swings if the shafts are not suitable for them, particularly if they are nervous, so ideally you want to pick shafts that are suitable for your current swing rather than try and change your swing speed and tempo to try and suit the shafts.

3. VALUE FOR MONEY IN SECOND HAND GOLF CLUBS AND WHAT TO LOOK OUT FOR

If you are buying any second hand irons and wedges, I think the clubs that are the best value for money are the clubs that have clubfaces that are in very good condition (ie the clubs have not been used that much). The less the clubs have been used the sharper the grooves will be. Grooves on irons and wedges gradually get less sharp over time after hitting lots of golf balls. Sharp grooves will give you the highest and most consistent backspin levels possible which is important when you want to stop the ball quickly, which most often is when you are using your wedges and short irons. 

A big problem with buying second hand golf clubs online is that photos can be deceptive. You can’t see the clubs in person so you have to rely on the seller’s photos to let you know what condition the clubfaces are in. I have learned that if photos are not taken very close up to the clubfaces, at the right angle and in good lighting, the photos will not properly show clubface wear and stone chips. For a set of irons, if a photo shows all of the clubfaces together in the one photo the camera is not close enough to any of the clubfaces to properly show up clubface wear and stone chips. It will give you an idea of the condition of the clubfaces but it won’t give you the full picture. You will see examples of this if you look at some of my listings for irons and compare the photo of all the clubfaces together in the one photo to the close up shots of each clubface.

I find the value of second hand golf clubs hard to predict because the price someone is willing to pay for them can vary a lot from golfer to golfer but in general, the market value of second hand golf clubs is down to a mixture of club condition (in particular the clubfaces) and how old the clubs are, relative to the price of what new clubs cost of the same model/ equivalent model.

Many golfers will assume or think that newer golf clubs must be better or perform better than older ones or some golfers will just want the latest clubs even if they don’t think they are actually better. This makes older golf clubs worth less to many people than newer ones but many golfers will prioritise condition, not the age of the clubs so clubs in good condition will be worth more to many people than clubs in bad condition. The older the clubs are, the less likely they are to be in good condition though because people have had more time to use them but this is not always the case. Sometimes people will buy new golf clubs, keep them for many years but rarely use them and then sell them.

The top brands of clubheads release a new range of irons every two years or so with minor tweaks made. Brands may tell you about all the improvements they have made to try and get you to buy the latest clubs but these changes I think will be very minor and are mostly cosmetic changes, rather than actual changes in performance which is very hard to prove without robot testing which I suspect they are either not doing or are doing but are not making the results of their robot testing available to the public because the new clubs are not any better than the older ones, other than the worn groove issue for second hand wedges and irons. An interesting fact is that in 1999, David Duval (former world number one who had a short time at the top of the game) shot 59 on a par 72 course that measured 6950 yards at the time, so it’s possible to shoot a crazy low score using golf clubs that would now be regarded as really old but I assume that he was likely using nearly new irons and wedges for that time, in which case the grooves would have been sharp.

If you buy new irons you should also get a warranty in case something goes wrong with the irons but irons are built to last many years so it’s very unlikely that you would actually need a warranty for a new set of irons but some sellers of second hand golf clubs also give a warranty as well, but the warranty may not last as long. I give a 12 month warranty for my second hand iron sets. 

If you are curious as to what could go wrong with a set of irons, between the ages of around 14 to 17 I had used a set of around 15 year old Lynx irons on a regular basis that were my Dad’s old clubs that he had previously used for many years and during those few years the one big problem that occurred with the clubs was the 4 iron clubhead came off the end of the shaft after hitting a random full shot from the fairway. I paid my club pro to get the club re-shafted with a new shaft and that was the only thing that went wrong with those irons for the three or so years that I used the clubs. I can’t properly remember but from memory the steel shafts had significant rust/ light pitting and the rusting at the bottom of the shaft was very likely the cause of the clubhead separating from the shaft but you can avoid shaft rusting by drying shafts with a towel after you get home from playing golf in the rain. I would also recommend cleaning and drying the clubheads as well to avoid clubhead rusting and to make sure that your golf bag has fully dried before putting clubs back into your bag. Keeping your clubs in a dry room of your house, rather than in a moist garage will make sure the clubs stay dry. 

The grooves were very worn on the Lynx irons before I ever started using them because my Dad regularly used the clubs for many years before I started to play with them. I played at a firm links course so I had to intentionally land the ball short of every green to play for the ball to run out and it wasn’t until I got new irons in 2010 and saw how quickly the ball was stopping in comparison to my old Lynx irons that I realised how worn the grooves actually were. The grooves on my irons had the new ‘V’ grooves that came in 2009/2010 as well but the grooves were sharp because they were brand new clubs. The ‘V’ grooves, which produce less backspin than the old square grooves, particularly from the semi rrough and good lies in the rough were brought in on all irons and wedges made after 2009 because golf’s governing bodies thought that pro golfers were not getting punished enough for missing fairways because golfers could still stop the ball quickly on greens when hitting from the semi rough/ good lies in the rough, so you would actually be an advantage if you buy a set of irons or wedges (in good condition ie sharp grooves) made in 2008 or earlier compared to any iron set made after 2009. However, irons and wedges with the old square grooves are illegal in professional tournaments and elite level amateur competitions such as the British Amateur but they are still legal for normal and inter club competitions.   

For Drivers, woods and hybrids or putters I don’t think you are at any significant advantage performance wise by using the latest equipment so my advice would be to go for older models to get value for money. However, clubs with adjustable hosels (drivers, woods and hybrids) first came out around 2010 which allow you to quickly change the loft and lie angle of the club to help you adjust your ball flight so if you buy a club before that time the club will not have that feature.

Considering second hand iron sets that you are looking at on eBay, my advice would be to think about what price the clubs are worth to you, compared to what the latest new equivalent model of irons would cost you. You could do a search on eBay for the same iron model to see what other sellers are selling the clubs at but as mentioned previously, the condition of the clubs could vary significantly so you aren’t comparing like with like. The shafts in other iron sets could be different as well which may not be suitable for you. 

If you buy any iron set (new or second hand), use them frequently and sell them after a number of years, you will very likely have to sell them for less than you paid for them. There’s really no way to avoid that but if you can buy a suitable second hand iron set for your golf game (that’s in good condition) for much less than what the latest new equivalent irons cost, you will have saved yourself a lot of money.

If you are someone who does want a brand new iron set, you can sometimes get a much better deal if you can buy a new set that isn’t one of the latest ones. If golf shops (both physical and online) have not sold all of the previous models the price will often come down to try and shift them before the new range comes out. The previous models will be significantly cheaper than the latest ones, often by hundreds of pounds but you may only be able to get them with the ‘stock’ shafts which may not be what you want.

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4. DIFFERENT IRONS AVAILABLE AND THE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN THEM

There are three different ‘types’ of golf irons available:

1. Cavity back irons
2. Bladed irons (or ‘blades’)
3. Muscle back irons

Cavity back irons: 

A cavity back iron is one that has a hollow section in the back of the club. This removes mass from the centre of the clubface and distributes it to the outside edges of the clubhead, which provides lots of forgiveness. ‘True’ cavity back irons look quite chunky behind the ball i.e they have big clubfaces, thick toplines and will also likely have a lot of offset (offset is how far the leading edge of the clubface is to the right hand side of the hosel for a right handed golfer looking at the club in the address position). Cavity back irons will have a significant amount of offset because it makes it easier to square the clubface at impact and most amateur golfers either fade or slice the golf ball, particularly higher handicappers.

Since cavity back irons are so forgiving, you can hit the ball out of the toe or the heel of the clubface and you should find it difficult to tell where on the clubface you made contact just based on the feel or sound of the ball off the face, apart from if the ball didn’t go quite as far as expected. However, if you thin the ball or hit it heavy, you should be able to tell as soon as you hit it.

All irons that are regarded as ‘game improvement irons’ (which are aimed at mid to high handicappers) are cavity back irons.

Bladed irons:

Bladed irons (or ‘blades’) are traditional, ‘old school’ looking irons with a very thin top-down look and small sweet spot. The clubfaces of bladed irons will also be smaller than cavity back irons. A blade sounds great when you strike the ball out of the centre of the clubface but it will be very obvious when the centre of the clubface is missed because it won’t feel or sound the same. Off-centre shots also result in a larger loss of distance and loss of accuracy compared to cavity back irons.

Hardly anyone actually uses true blade irons anymore because they are so unforgiving. Some pro golfers and very low handicap golfers that consistently hit the ball out of the centre of the clubface may choose to use blades because of either looks, feel and because many people think that blades give the most control over trajectory and shot shape (draws or fades), although many people disagree about that (more on that further below with a good youTube video).

Muscle back irons:

Muscle back irons also get called ‘blades’ by many people but they are not the same. A muscle back iron will have a thicker base and sole than a blade. The increased mass in the back of a muscle back iron gives the club more forgiveness on off centre hits compared to a blade but muscle back irons and bladed irons look nearly identical to each other to the golfer when the clubs are in the address positon. Muscle back irons and blades both have that thin top-down look which most good players like the look of and the clubfaces are smaller than on cavity back irons. A muscle back iron is essentially the modern version of a blade.

Even though muscle back irons offer less forgiveness than cavity back irons, many golfers like that the reduced forgiveness provides great feedback. What this means is that the low levels of forgiveness of muscleback irons will make it obvious to you when you hit the ball out of the toe or heel by a significant amount, based on the feel and the sound of the ball off the face.

Confusing points on muscle back and cavity back irons:

The top brands of clubheads release a range of irons every two years or so which will feature four to six different clubhead models. At one end will be a set of ‘true’ muscle back irons and at the other end will be a set of ‘true’ cavity back irons and the irons in the middle of those two extremes and will have varying levels of forgiveness, clubface size, topline thickness and offset. Some of these iron models I would describe as a sort of muscle back/ cavity back hybrid. For example, Titleist are one brand of clubheads that bring out a set of irons every two years which they call ‘CB’ which stands for cavity back. The Titleist CB irons look very much like musclebacks to the golfer when the clubs are in the address position but they have a small cavity in the back for increased forgiveness compared to the Titleist ‘MB’ (muscleback) irons. The Titleist CB irons are not really true or proper cavity back irons. Other brands will sell something similar and could get called either muscle backs or cavity backs by the brand. These clubs would all be aimed at good golfers and tour pros who want muscleback irons that are a bit more forgiving. They also could have a little bit more offset and slightly bigger clubfaces than muscleback irons as well. (That’s the case with the Titleist CB’s compared to MB’s but it’s a very small difference.)

Some cavity back irons will actually look like muscle back irons when you look at the back of the clubheads, (such as the Taylormade P790’s) but these clubs do actually have a cavity in the backs of them, ie part of the clubhead is hollow but you just can’t see it. So sometimes when you are looking at second hand iron sets on eBay you will need to use google to find out if the irons are cavity backs or not. 

Mark Crossfield did a youTube video called: 

‘GOLF CLUB MYTHS - CAVITY OR BLADED IRONS WORKABLE TEST’ 

(Please do a youTube search for that if you would like to watch it). In this video he and other good golfers compared a ‘game improvement’ cavity back iron to a muscle back iron when they were trying to work the ball. Both clubs in their test had the same loft (31 degrees) and they also had the same shaft. What they found was that they were getting near identical results with both clubs when they were trying to hit draws and fades, as well as hitting the ball high and low.

Cavity back irons versus muscle back irons- which should you use?

If you are someone who wants as much forgiveness as possible in your irons and this is your top priority, then ‘game improvement’ cavity back irons are your best choice. One potential problem though I think with game improvement irons are that in most cases the ‘stock’ (most common) shafts in them are either light weight steel or graphite shafts which I think are actually lighter than ideal for many golfers because in general, light weight shafts make it harder to find the centre of the clubface and hit the ball solid compared to heavier weight shafts, although this is just my opinion based on my own past golfing experience. The lighter the iron shaft is, the faster you should be able to swing it which most often makes it more difficult to hit the ball solid and your bad shots are bigger misses. How light is too light and how heavy is too heavy will vary from golfer to golfer so without trying iron shafts of different weights out you won’t know what shaft weight is most suited for you. Please read my guide on custom fitting elsewhere on this listing for more information about this and how to best use a custom fitting session when your aim is to buy a second hand set of irons afterwards.

(Lots of golfers have become too concerned with distance and I think that is why the top brands of clubheads are all using light weight shafts as the stock shafts in game improvement irons. It is possible to get heavier weight shafts in game improvement irons but you have to pay extra to get these shafts as a custom fit option when buying a new set of irons, which most golfers aren’t doing so most of the second hand ‘game improvement’ cavity back irons on eBay will have light to midweight shafts, ie under 120 grams.

If your priority in a set of irons is great feel and feedback and you hit the ball well and often out of the middle of the clubface and you also like a thin top-down look in your irons then go for a set of either muscle back irons or a set of the muscle back/ cavity back hybrids that have the features of both.

Extra points:

Golf is part mental and I think that if a golfer believes that the irons they are using are forgiving on off-centre hits then that belief can give the golfer more confidence and that confidence can make it more likely that they will make a good swing and hit a good shot. If a golfer believes that the irons they are using are not forgiving then that belief can scare a golfer a bit which can make it more likely that they will have negative thoughts during a swing and therefore more likely to make a bad swing and hit a bad shot. This is a sort of placebo effect so based on that, I think that many golfers will perform better with either cavity back muscle back hybrid irons or full on cavity back game improvement irons not only because the irons are more forgiving, but because a golfer believes they are more forgiving. This placebo effect may also be bigger when a golfer is nervous.

The clubheads you choose in your irons should be mainly decided by how much forgiveness you want on off centre hits. However, it’s really hard to properly compare the forgiveness levels of different iron clubheads on off-centre hits without the use of a golf robot that can strike the ball on the exact same point on a clubface, time after time. I am very unsure as to how big the difference in forgiveness levels actually is between a muscleback iron and game improvement cavity back iron, but I suspect that it’s made out to be more than it actually is. At the time of writing this the only golf robot testing I can find on youTube or online is when ‘2nd swing’ did robot testing to compare forgiveness levels on off-centre hits amongst different ‘muscle back/ cavity back hybrid’ irons. The problem with this video is that they were only comparing irons from different brands that were aimed at good players, so the forgiveness levels for distance were pretty much the same for the different irons in the test, although some were significantly straighter than others on off-centre hits. I would be interested to see this test done with game improvement irons versus muscle back irons which they may do at some point. For anyone interested in watching that youtube video, please do a youTube search for ‘ping robot testing data’ and its the first youTube result.

(To compare the forgiveness levels for the different irons in that test, what you need to do is compare the carry distances on the off-centre hits versus the carry distances in the centre hits. This is the only way to properly compare the different irons since the loft of a seven iron varies from one brand to another. For example, for the T100 seven iron (as shown at the 8:50 mark in the video) the average of the centre hits look like they were carrying close to 144.5 yards and the average of the ‘centre toe’ shots were carrying close to 131.5 yards. This would mean that the centre toe shots were carrying 91.003% of the distance of the centre shots (131.5/144.5 x100). This percentage is very close to all of the different iron models tested in that video.)

Many amateur golfers will like the idea of using clubs that their favourite pro golfers use, even if the clubs are not aimed at them. If scoring is not your priority then that is completely fine to do because it’s your money you are spending so I would advise to get the set of irons you want but bear in mind that most pros are using irons that are not forgiving so you will be punished for off-centre hits.

Interesting fact on a tour pro choosing to use game improvement irons:

Ben Curtis won a PGA tour event in 2012 using Titleist 712 AP1 irons in 4-PW which were Titleist’s ‘game improvement’ cavity back cast irons at the time, aimed at high handicappers, so this proves that even a tour pro can use game improvement irons. It’s very rare though for a tour pro to choose to use game improvement irons for all of their irons but occasionally pros will use them in their longer irons. Some people might say that Ben Curtis wasn’t very good but to be fair to him, he won $13.8 million on the PGA tour which puts him 144th on the all time career money list and he also won the 2003 British Open.

Forged versus cast irons:

Golf irons can be either forged or cast.

A forged golf iron is a club in which the clubhead is made out of one solid block of metal. The metal is carved into shape and the clubhead is one solid piece of material. 

A cast iron is an iron that is made from a mold. Hot liquid metal is poured into the mold into the desired shape of clubhead and the result is a cast iron golf club.

Most irons aimed at good golfers such as muscle backs and the muscleback/ cavity back hybrids are forged and nearly all ‘game improvement’ cavity back irons aimed at mid to high handicappers are cast. 

Forged irons are made with a softer metal than cast irons so many golfers would say that you get a ‘softer’ feel when hitting balls with a forged iron compared to a cast iron, which many golfers like. However, in a youTube video done by Mark Crossfield titled 

‘FORGED OR CAST GOLF CLUBS WHAT IS FEEL’ 

Mark and the testers very much question that you can actually tell the difference between a forged and cast iron based only on how the club feels when the clubface makes contact with the ball. It’s likely that any difference in ‘feel’ between a forged and cast iron is down to the sound of the ball off the face.

Cast irons are cheaper to make than forged irons which I understand is why game improvement irons are cheaper than forged irons.

Cast irons are also more durable than forged irons. The harder metal of cast irons means that they are more resistant to dents and stone chips. Forged irons can knock against each other in the golf bag during a round of golf and also during transport and this results in many very small dents in the clubheads, which is known as ‘bag clatter’. This can happen to cast irons as well but in general more force is needed to create the same dent in a cast iron compared to a forged iron so cast irons don’t get quite ‘beat up’ as much. ‘Bag clatter’ can be mostly avoided by using iron head covers, (although many golfers think that using iron headcovers is uncool) but a lack of bag clatter could maybe make the re-sale value of your irons higher if you sell the clubs in future.

Some golfers think that forged irons give them more consistent backspin numbers compared to cast irons which would often be a main reason as to why a good golfer would choose a forged irons over cast irons, but as mentioned above, Ben Curtis won that PGA tour event using cast irons and there are other pro golfers using cast irons so I would question whether forged irons actually do give more consistent backspin numbers compared to cast irons but again, with any of these theories it’s hard to properly test them out without golf robot  testing because any difference in backspin numbers between each shot could be down to the golfer such as exact strike location etc and not because the club is forged or cast. There are golfers on tour that use forged irons and there will be some that use cast irons but the majority will be choosing to use forged.

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6. THE BEST ADVICE ON HOW TO KNOW IF YOU HAVE BOUGHT A SET OF COUNTERFEIT IRONS ONLINE:

Key points:

1. The loft and lie angles of counterfeit irons will very likely be irregular. The swing weights will almost certainly be irregular.

2. The easiest and quickest way to identify counterfeit irons is to measure all of the loft angles. Measuring and calculating the swing weights is better but it takes more time. The ‘more detail on measurements’ part of the listing explains how you can accurately measure loft angles and swing weights. You can do both without any expensive equipment.

3. You can watch a good youTube video on counterfeit irons if you do a youTube search for ‘online fakes project left’ and watch the first video on the results page.

I normally only buy and sell iron sets so I can’t properly comment for any other golf clubs being sold on eBay but from my experience of buying and selling lots of iron sets, I’m pretty sure that the majority that are being sold on eBay are NOT counterfeit but unfortunately as long as people keep making counterfeit golf clubs it’s very likely that some will end up getting sold on eBay. Sellers on eBay may actually be completely unaware that the clubs they are counterfeit because they bought the clubs off someone else second hand.

I think that some businesses who sell new and second hand iron sets deliberately try and make counterfeit golf clubs out to be a far bigger problem than they actually are in an attempt to try and get you to buy irons off them by scaring you into thinking that if you were to buy a set of irons from a random seller on eBay, there’s a good chance that they would be counterfeit, which is not true. I have spent time and have fully researched this topic because I want to be as sure as possible that no one buys a counterfeit set of irons from me and this is what I have learned:

Some counterfeit irons are obviously fake just by looking at them or even by just looking at photos of them. The clubs just won’t look right and they will look ‘fake’ but some counterfeit irons do look really good and are much harder to spot just by looking at them without carefully looking at the clubs and comparing them side by side with known genuine irons of the same model in person and/or measuring the loft angles of all the irons in the set or measuring and calculating the swing weights. In many cases you won’t have known genuine irons of the same model to compare the clubs to so I think that measuring the loft angles or finding out the swing weights is better.

The goal of people making counterfeit golf clubs are to make clubs that look as much as possible like the real thing as cheaply as possible so that they scam people out of their money by tricking people into thinking that they are buying genuine clubs. I highly doubt the counterfeiters care about how their clubs performs and therefore are not spending the time and money to make them perform like the real thing. For example, I saw on a youTube video that a club pro measured the loft and lie angles of all of the irons in a set of fake Titleist 718 AP2 irons that he had got the hold of and the 5 iron had a stronger loft than the 4 iron and the 9 iron had a stronger loft than the 8 iron, so if you were to use that set of irons you would obviously likely hit the 5 iron further than the 4 iron and the 9 iron further than the 8 iron. For anyone who wants to watch the youtube video, please do a youtube search for ‘online fakes projectleft’ and it’s the first youtube result. The counterfeit irons in that video are an example of what I think are a ‘good’ set of counterfeits in that the counterfeiters have done a good job at making the clubheads look like the real thing. If you were just looking at the clubheads of the counterfeit set on their own without comparing them to a genuine set it would be hard to know for sure that they were fake just by looking at them but in this particular set of counterfeit irons the most obvious visual giveaway are the clear and obvious fake looking Project X shaft labels which will look fake to anyone who has recently seen genuine Project X shaft labels because they look really different.

The main reason I started measuring the loft and lie angles of all the irons that I sell is because I think this is the best, quickest and easiest way to identify a counterfeit set of irons when you don’t have another set of irons of the exact same model (that you know are definitely genuine) to compare them to. I actually think this is a better method of identifying fakes than visually comparing two sets of irons side by side because I have seen photos online of a ‘good looking’ counterfeit Titleist AP3 5 iron versus a genuine Titleist AP3 5 iron side by side* and when I first looked at the photos the differences between the two clubheads looked very subtle to me and were not clear and obvious which scared me a bit when I first looked at them but since you can quickly and accurately measure the loft angles of the irons that would be a more clear cut way to know that the clubs were fake if the loft angles were up the left. However, measuring the loft angles is not a completely foolproof method of identifying counterfeit irons because the loft and lie angles on irons often gradually shift a bit over time with use (particularly lie angles) but not to the extent that the 9 iron becomes a stronger loft than the 8 iron etc. Someone could also potentially take a counterfeit set of irons to a club pro or someone who has a loft/lie machine and get them to adjust the loft and lie angles of the clubs. I think it is unlikely that someone would take the time and spend the money to do that but it’s possible. There’s also the issue of many club pros being super cautious and only willing to adjust loft or lie angles by a small amount out of fear of breaking clubs so they may not even be willing to adjust the loft angles to what they should be. I don’t think that measuring and calculating the swing weights of irons is necessary to identity counterfeit irons but if you would like to be as sure as possible that the irons are not counterfeit then I would recommend doing so. If the counterfeiters can’t even get the loft angles right, they almost certainly won’t get the swing weights right. It would also be almost impossible for anyone to get the swing weights right after the clubs have been made. If the swing weights are very irregular you would need to add significant weight to either end of the golf clubs through adding lead tape either on the clubheads or on the shafts or by installing grips of different weights, in order to alter the swing weight of any of the clubs and you would be able to see if that has been done just by looking at the clubs. 

(*Please do a google search for ‘ Titleist AP3 golfclubbrokers’ to see the side by side photos of the genuine versus counterfeit AP3 5 iron. In that particular counterfeit club the most obvious giveaways to me from just looking at the photos are the longer than normal ferrule (for a Titleist 718 iron) and bigger than normal KBS tour shaft label that also has different font. Please note that sometimes people get irons reshafted and use ferrules which did not originally come with the iron set so in those situations genuine irons could have ferrules that are the ‘wrong’ length.)

Counterfeiters often put serial numbers on golf clubs to try and make them look authentic and not all genuine iron sets will have serial numbers so looking at serial numbers is not a good way to identify counterfeit golf clubs.

At the time of writing this I have measured the loft and lie angles of at least 500 second hand iron sets and on only four of these occasions were there irregular loft angles of any irons in the set i.e. the 9 iron having a stronger loft than the 8 iron etc. One was a set of Titleist 695 mb’s that actually looked fake to me before I even measured the loft and lie angles but the loft angles (and actually the lie angles as well) were both irregular. One was a set of ‘Taylormade R11 irons’ that actually had the same dodgy looking Project X shaft labels as on the fake Titleist AP2 irons in that projectleft youTube video. Other than from the shaft labels I could not tell that the clubs were fake just by looking at them but I did not visually compare them side by side against another set of Taylormade R11 irons. I recently got hold of two new sets of ‘Taylormade P790 irons’ in 4-PW which I thought were counterfeit just by looking at the clubs but I was not certain. 

I measured the loft and lie angles of both sets and sure enough they were irregular on both sets.

For anyone that is interested to know, I measured the loft angles on set 1 to be: 

(in order from 4-PW)

23.9, 22.5,  31.8, 30.5, 39.7, 38.5, 44.4

For set 2:

23.0, 22.0, 27.7, 28.9, 37.9, 38.2, 45.5

I measured the lie angles on set 1 to be:

61.7, 61.5, 61.4, 61.8, 63.2, 62.5, 63.2.

Set 2:

61.0, 61.6, 61.6, 61.1, 61.8, 62.9, 63.0

I measured the club lengths of all of the irons in one of the sets and they were very close to what they should have been. For the 2nd set I just put the clubs over the edge of the box that I was using at the time, like I do when taking photos and none of the clubs had irregular lengths but I didn’t actually measure them with a metal ruler.

I am no longer in possession of either of those iron sets and I have only since found out that you can accurately measure and calculate swing weights of golf clubs without using any expensive equipment or else I would have done that for those two iron sets as well.

You can measure loft and lie angles on irons (and wedges) yourself using a digital inclinometer but the club needs to be set up properly and you need to know what you’re doing to measure them accurately enough to identify fakes. Please see the ‘more detail on measurements’ part of the listing if you would like more information on how to do this. I think it is actually easier to accurately measure and calculate the swing weight of a golf club but it takes more time.

If you do buy a second hand iron set on eBay (or any other golf club) and later discover that they are counterfeit you are completely covered by eBay’s money back guarantee and you will get a guaranteed refund from eBay if you open a case within 30 days of the delivery date, or the estimated delivery date (whichever is later) but it needs to be done within the 30 days to be covered.

7. Cleaning irons and wedges/ how to keep them in the best possible condition and keep the re-sale value as high as possible when the time comes to sell them:

Cleaning golf irons and wedges and drying them afterwards is most important to do after you get home from playing golf in either the rain or on wet grass, because if you don’t keep the clubs dry then rust will form on the clubs. Cleaning irons and wedges after playing with them will keep them in the best possible condition and will mean you will get longer out of them and it will also keep the re-sale value as high as possible in case you decide to sell them again in future.

(In my opinion) this is the best method to clean golf clubheads and faces:

First buy a deep bucket (if you don’t already have one) and then fill with cold or luke warm water (or you could also use a sink.) The reason I advise not using hot water is because I have read that if you get hot water on the ferrules it can cause them to become loose.

Other things you’ll need:

1. Sponge (or a facecloth or small towel)
2. Cheap or old toothbrush (or brush from a groove cleaner but not the metal brushes because they will likely score clubfaces).
3. A dry towel.

Steps:

1. Take a golf club and dunk the clubhead into the bucket of water.
2. Use the sponge etc to give the clubhead and clubface a rubdown to remove as much dirt as possible. If there is a cavity in the back of the clubhead make sure you get in there with the sponge and use the toothbrush if necessary to remove any dirt.
3. Remove the clubhead from the bucket and then use the toothbrush to brush back and forward along the grooves to remove as much dirt as possible.
4. Dunk the clubhead back into the bucket and move it around to give it a good rinse.
5. Remove the clubhead from the water and check that all dirt has been removed from the clubhead and if not then take the toothbrush and go over any missed parts.
6. Repeat step 4 if necessary.
7. Dry the clubhead and clubface with a towel, making sure you get into the cavity in the back of the clubhead (if there is one) in case any water is trapped in there.
8. Dry the shaft with the towel as well, particularly if its steel which will prevent rust from forming on the shaft which would lead to pitting (tiny holes forming in the shaft).
9. Make sure your golf bag is dry before putting any of your clubs back inside it. If you were playing in the rain you may have to turn it upside down and leave it to dry in the garage etc. for at least 12 hours.
10. Repeat these steps with the rest of your irons and wedges. Empty and refill your bucket with more water as necessary whenever the water inside your bucket gets too dirty.
11. Store your golf clubs in a dry room of your house. Sometimes garages can have moist air which can cause the shafts and clubheads to rust.

8. Cleaning golf grips/ how to get longer out of them before the need to replace them:

(In my opinion) this is the best method to clean golf grips:

First buy a deep bucket (if you don’t already have one) and then fill with cold water. (You could also use a deep sink.)

Other things you’ll need:

    1. A facecloth or very small towel.

    2. A dry towel.

Method:

1. Take a golf club and stick a golf tee in the hole at the end of the grip.
2. Dunk the whole of the golf grip into the bucket of water and make sure all of the grip gets wet. 
3. Remove the grip from the water and then use either a cloth, small towel or your hand to give the grip a rub down.
4. Dunk the grip back into the bucket and move it around to give it a good rinse.
5. Remove the grip from the bucket and then remove the golf tee from the end of the grip.
6. Dry the grip with a towel (and dry the shaft as well in case any part got wet).
7. Leave the club against a wall etc and ideally give it a number of hours to fully dry before putting the club back into your golf bag.
8. Repeat this with all of your golf clubs.

(Putting the golf tee in the hole at the end of the grip stops water getting inside the shafts and causing rusting).

Some people like to use some dish washing liquid or liquid hand soap when cleaning golf clubs and golf grips but I don’t like doing so because I don’t think it’s necessary and I’m also concerned about accidentally not rinsing it all off and leaving clubs or grips feeling a bit soapy.

I’m sorry if this is all obvious or sounds patronising to whoever is reading this but I am being specific as to what exactly I do in case anyone finds it helpful.